Post a vulgar comment at work, lose your job

November 16, 2009 by Kurt
Filed under: commenting 
Courtesy altemark via Flickr

Courtesy altemark via Flickr

A single vulgar word cost a man his job on Friday.

It all started with Friday’s edition of Talk of the Day, a regular blog on the St. Louis Post-Dispatch’s website, STLtoday.com. Talk of the Day is exactly that. A conversation around the water-cooler topic of the day. Friday’s edition is often a little lighter. Last week, it was about the strangest things you’ve ever eaten, loosely pegged on a story about deer meat.

By mid-morning, a number of folks had commented about their experiences with Bird’s Nest Soup, octopus, cow brains and rattlesnake. Then, while I was in our 10 a.m. news meeting, someone posted a vulgar, two-syllable word for a part of a woman’s anatomy. It was there only a minute before a colleague deleted it.

A few minutes later, the same guy posted the same single-word comment again. I deleted it, but noticed in the WordPress e-mail that his comment had come from an IP address at a local school. So I called the school. They were happy to have me forward the e-mail, though I wasn’t sure what they’d be able to do with the meager information it included.

About six hours later, I heard from the school’s headmaster. The school’s IT director took a shine to the challenge. Long story short: Using the time-frame of the comments, our website location and the IP addresses in the WordPress e-mail, he tracked it back to a specific computer. The headmaster confronted the employee, who resigned on the spot.

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Comments

  • Ira Mitchell
    You seem to revel in the fact that a guy who made a mildly-offensive, silly comment on an asinine blog post is no longer employed. That's a dick move in and of itself.

    However, the worst part of all of this is what you think passes for interesting content. "Strangest thing you ever ate?" What's next, "Tell us your favorite song?" Something tells me you're going to see many things worse than the "P" word on what you call columns in the future thanks to a certain type of media on which you feel you're an expert.

    For someone who has self-annointed himself the "STL Social Media Guy", you're pretty clueless -- and perhaps dangerous to the Social Media movement (from a laughingstock perspective at the very least).

    Oh and if you're going to report me to my boss for an implied (again) "P" word, that's fine.
  • john
    first off "strangest things you've ever eaten?" is a lazy and juvenile prompt to begin a conversation. it almost begs a juvenile response.

    then for a newspaper to use it to slam free speech is down right ugly.

    i'm signing my name on the petition to fire kurt greenbaum!
  • sam
    """
    We will not share individual user information with third parties unless the user has specifically approved the release of that information.
    """
    -- http://www.stltoday.com/help/privacy-policy

    Do you often ignore your own policies? Why bother making such claims in the first place then?

    I hope the now unemployed person has a lawyer friend.
  • ln_ib
    Sounds like you should get rid of your commenting system if you're going to react like that. You've now compromised the integrity of your paper, as well as really screwed up somebody's life, and you don't know any better than to brag about it.
  • Buddhika Gebrial
    What were you thinking when you called the school? Maybe something like "Ha, I'll show him who's boss" ?

    I'll be awaiting your reply.
  • J Henry Waugh
    That was a horrible thing to do. Just delete the comment if it offends your sensibilities so much. Ugh.
  • jonquimbly
    Kurt,

    Did you just recently begin using the Internet? Did you know that many people comment from work, and use profanity? Getting a user fired because you didn't like their mildly profane comment? Did you just time-travel from the 19th century or something?

    Interestingly, I found no clause in P-D's TOS or the commenters "Rules of the Road" that call for the sort of aggressive revenge you engaged in.

    Here's hoping somebody tracks you down for profanity posted from work and gets you fired!

    What absolutely shameful, anti-social behavior for someone who goes by the title "Social Media Guy."
  • ghv
    So strange that newspapers are going out of business, isn't it? Alienating readers? Great business plan. Good luck in the new media landscape Kurt. And no, I'm not posting from a job, so you can't get me fired, bigshot.
  • QWERTY
    Oh dude. In an age where news organizations are fighting to protect the anonymity of their readers/posters, you went out of your way to call one out, and it resulted in him losing his job. Was his comment juvenile and unnecessary? Absolutely. But in my humble opinion, your response was 100 times worse. Thanks for maintaining that journalistic integrity there Kurt. I'll make sure to stay away from any publication you write for in the future.
  • Craig Rutledge
    I would think that someone who works for Lee Publications would have more sympathy for those who lose their jobs. Since reductions in force and crappy websites seem to be two of their biggest foci these days.

    Oh I am writing this from my home, on my own time. I do not live with my parents, so please don't call my mommy and tell her that the bad man hurt your feelings, she'll only be confused.
  • bradmo
    Very, very odd. I agree that banning the user would have been appropriate.

    I think you're going to reap what you've sown.
  • CrazyGoatidol
    Wow. This is something you should feel shame over, not brag about. As a parent, I'd rather have that former school employee around my child than you. There's a chance he/she might have something worthwhile to contribute to society.
  • Everett
    Are you serious? Why in the world would you do something like that, particularly when a permaban would have been much easier and just as effective?
  • "So I called the school."

    Wow, poor judgment. That was quite an over-reaction on your part. Why not just ban the commenter?
  • Jim Hacking
    Uncool, methinks.
  • How far down the slope is it to where a reporter sends a post about someone's unpopular political beliefs to an employer ? This could cause real problems for people in some communities or over some issues. Kurt, that you would do this, and then crow about it, shows you lack the judgment necessary to be a journalist. You are the one who should lose his job over this incident.
  • Kevin Mitnick
    Uh oh, here comes trouble!

    What you just did undermines the concept of journalistic integrity or the idea of freedom of speech. Even if you had just deleted the comment and gone about your day whistling dixie, you wouldn't have to deal with the oncoming barrage of internet users that are about to come your way. You are the "director of social media". This is the internet! Anyone can say whatever they want! But you gave him attention... this is going to get worse before it gets better...
  • Jezmund
    I don't get why you had to call the school? All you care about is your board, right? Delete comment. Move on.

    The only way to know where the IP addy came from is to do a reverse DNS lookup. Certainly, you don't just "know" who various area class A, B, or C subnets belong to, unless of course maybe your an idiot savant..?..?
  • michaelk42
    Also: the "Think Of The Children!" defense is lame.

    What you did may have been legal as well as permissible under your site's rules, but that doesn't make it ethical or proportionate to the "offense."

    Writing the gloating blog post about it, however, is what really puts it over the line.

    Just think, if you hadn't posted this, most people would have never known.
  • michaelk42
    So basically you're a humorless jerk, Kurt, and you're proud of it.

    Way to make your paper look good, too, now that everyone knows it has a staff willing to turn people in if they say things the staff dislikes. Ought to be helpful developing sources.
  • Really? You got someone fired over a vulgarity, which sounds like it was posted in jest?
  • Jay Rehak
    Not really your job to do what you did. I think you crossed an ethical line. This is not to say I support the person who wrote the vulgarity, but it certainly is not your job to investigate where comments come from. This is very disappointing and I think you should be fired.

    PS I am a teacher, not working at the present moment. I would prefer not to be tracked by you or anyone in your news organization.
  • I vote hoax. So far we have no confirmation of the person who quit his job, the school where he supposedly worked, or even the post in question. The only confirmation of any of this comes from Kurt Greenbaum.

    The story is rather outlandish. The school's headmaster is actually going to call back and tell the guy who ratted that, "Hey, yea, that guy quit. Thanks."

    The long story is short because it's all made up. That's my analysis.
  • The internet is serious business. I hope you enjoy your pasta Kurt.
  • I think this is a complete overreaction. I would never in a million years post what this guy did and I generally avoid the stltoday comments because they are fodder for these exact jokes (and often much worse)... but c'mon calling the school is a complete overreach of authority and probably against your terms of use.

    The anonymous racist / hate speech on stltoday.com's most "read" stories all the time isn't cleaned up exact the occasional "no personal attacks post by moderators", but someone's vulgar attempt at a joke results in a call to the school? Very consistent policy there.

    Stltoday.com should fix the comments once and for all and Kurt you shouldn't be as proud of this as you clearly seem to be.
  • Hi Kurt: I'm curious. Did you really not know what they could do with the information included in the email? Maybe you didn't want what happened to happen, but you had to have some idea of what the IT department could do, right? I deal with this kind of thing all the time as the ME of UGC at a news organization but I have a team of moderators who approve and disapprove comments in real-time. i know you were frustrated but why not just ban the guy? Believe me, I'm no advocate for trolls by a long shot but did you consider contacting him directly or just denying him posting privileges?
  • Brian G
    While I'll agree with you that this user's post was inappropriate given the context, you ruined someone's life because they posted a word that only conservative, utterly repressed people without even the slightest sense of humor would ever consider "offensive." Then you felt it necessary to brag about your actions on your blog, indicating to everyone that your extreme overreaction to one inappropriate comment was perfectly rational.

    While I don't know you, Mr. Greenbaum, this is one of the most small-minded actions I've ever seen any individual take. It's truly disappointing you won't face any sort of justice for what you've done, and I can't see how you can possibly consider yourself a "director of social media" when you are so clearly disconnected from the public you claim to represent.
  • Proud STL Resident
    Kurt,

    Thank you for getting our small local paper so much global attention! I'm sure STLToday.com is grateful to have a (slightly better than high-school level) journalist calling around and having their readers' jobs put in jeopardy. Good for you.

    Now that you've told everyone about it, so that they can all see the stellar example of a human being that you are, I bet you'll soon be the most popular man in the city (if not the state, or the country). You're a national hero for saving those children from that evil juvenile teacher. Maybe a meeting with the president is in order (though I'm sure you would turn it down, because you're above even him in morals, right?).

    Don't worry about what you did, being that it wasn't legal or anything (I'm concidering your privacy policy). The rightous always overcome.
  • ed
    Good for you. I do not think you are responsible for losing this jerk's job. He is responsible for his own actions and if his employer did not approve of him using the school's computers to post vulgar comments on the web they are within their rights to reprimand him, fire him, or force him to resign. Too many people use the anonymity of the internet to say things they would never say to someone's face. Maybe if more people did what you did there would be more civility on the web.
  • KB
    I had no idea profanity came in degrees of offensiveness. Here I was under the impression that profanity is profanity. Some people may find profanity humorous while others do not. The important thing to remember is that people have varying sensibilities. On a personal site, profanity might be accepted, however, not so on a professional one. In both cases, being invited to comment on a website is like being invited to comment in someone's living room. In such a setting, would the anonymous commentator still have blurted out the word in question?

    While Kurt's reaction may be construed as extreme, there are other points to consider:

    * The commentator is culpable. He should have used better judgement when commenting, especially while at work (when he should have been *working*).

    * If there was a defined comment policy, the commentator should have kept his comments in line with such. The website was not his to deface and, if it is not allowed, a vulgar comment can be seen as defacement. (Free speech doesn't extend to *someone else's* website unless the website owner says so.)

    * The comment *was* deleted and the commentator posted it a second time. Logically, most people would realize that their comment being deleted a first time would mean it should not be re-posted unless requested, but apparently jobless-fellow is not to be included in that group.

    * The commentator was not fired, he quit when confronted. On some level, he knew and understood what he'd done to be wrong. Granted, he may have acted hastily in resigning because the headmaster may only have reprimanded him for the behaviour. But, ultimately he has no one to blame but himself.

    What people, especially in this day and age, fail to realize is that all actions have consequences--whether good or bad. People can say that Kurt abused his power, but the same can be said about anonymous commentators. When does this cycle end?

    Frankly, this world be a far better place if people learned to exercise a bit more respect for one another and look at a given situation from more than a single point of view.

    Kurt did not need to confront the commentator's employer, but the commentator did not need to leave the comment (multiple times). And the fact that he was at a school--an institution of learning--only makes it worse; what are our children learning nowadays?
  • Ron
    I don't know why the comments were closed on the STL site, but I'm amazed at all the folks who think you were in the wrong. As a few have mentioned, it was that person's choice to post the vulgar word.. twice.. and they are responsible for their own actions. I think its the fact that most people can't accept responsibility for their actions that drives them to blame someone, in this case you. At any rate, as you are well aware, you acted entirely appropriately in this case.
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